A way to combat newcommers leaving.

[Grotebozebeer]

I think it wil be a great idea to make it clear to any new player joining this game, that they can seek out ARPK Guilds if they seek protection and a place to learn the ropes.
And i mean like, embed it in the Haven tutorial or something. Together with a lil guide about how you need to aproach this game in a diffrent matter.

Just the idea of Guilds fighting for the justice of the world is, in my book, a realy cool feature and im sure that im not the only one.

I played Darkfall aswell, loved the concept and the game itself. Didnt love the seal clubbing as much tho, it got me frustrated, going to my momy crying like a little bitch.

But then i stumbled across a youtube vid, i think it was. That explained to me, the mindset you need to keep this game up. And its a whole lot of diffrent then your avrg wow, ragnarok blabla.

people only know this kind of mmo, and wil start playing MO with that mindset. If they get smoothed into the game a bit by a good written guide about the vision of this game and how to aproach, it might just make more new ppl stick around.



Im more of a Pve player then pvp tho i like both, I played MO1 for some time, i have expirienced the true nature of humanity with all its flaws and glory.

I want this game to succeed, but i bet you vets would love it even more. And lets be honest here, praying on noobs over and over is not healthy in the long term, or even short for that matter.
Hell, i dont understand why someone would get satisfaction out of this but they do, and this is the game to do it in, i see that.



So this is not a rant or pointing of the finger or about changing THE WAY, lets make that clear. Cause i know how u dogs can react.

The mmo cummunity is ready for this kind of game, i can already see Mo succeeding, ending the nich as it is. Might even be the next big shit! Can u imagine, blizzard making a Full loot.....

I mean, MO2 got more publicity in the last months then MO1 ever got, and i see a LOT of positive reactions on Youtubers like ESO and TheLazyPeon, this gives me a lot of hope.


Peace, but not to much!


Edit: Just thought of a downside to the ARPK idea, and thats publicity for ARPK guild, wich wouldnt be fair to RPK's. Tho we can all see the irony in the word fair here cant we?

Tho the upside of the downside could be that RPK's have more ppl to actualy fight.
It worked in, That what must not be named(WoW), in that after a while, horde and aliance where actualy divided. Same could happen here, constant war v/s good and bad.

RPK's wil be outnumbered, they wil bitch and we wil say, Git Gud, have some taste of ur own medicine. okey okey, lil salt in there.

 

[Vergil]

MO2 is already sunshine, rainbow and bunnies. Where it should be a dark post-apoc.

Please don't make it more gross.


Newcomers don't leave when they're killed. They leave because they're killed by the zerg most of the time. (if at all)
Guilds in general are zerg source, and the main issue. So your suggestion would amplify the problem.



Imagine small groups all over the map instead of empty dead map and one single mass zerg in a single town?
That's what we're loosing from the guild system. Guilds are in fact killing the game. Plain and simple.

Then again, there's:
- Lack of PvE content for the solo / small group;
- Lack of proper PvP balance (which is already aimed towards mass PvP than single / small groups);
- Lack of common sense of balance changes in each patch.
-- ...
-- endless list of the current MO2 flaws here --
-- ...
- Better games to play solo / small group

There's lots of issues that will cause newcomers to leave. And those are more problematic areas than just getting killed.

In the end, each and every person in this game would have to choose:
- Join the guild (aka the zerg brain-dead gameplay);
- Struggle solo / small group;
- Leave

An obvious and most simplest choice for the solo players just to leave.

Moreover, I'm afraid that this issue will be the end of MO. There may be a situation in the future, where only one massive guild will remain.
Which will cause people to just leave the game since there's literally no-one to PvP / todo. Resulting in a completely dead game.
It may not come soon after the release, but its a possibility, and a major flaw of the current guild system.

MO always failed to provide content for the solo players.
Hopes were high for the change in MO2, but alas, I doubt it would get addressed in near future (if at all).

 

[Grotebozebeer]

MO2 is already sunshine, rainbow and bunnies.

Please don't make it more gross than it already is.

I think it wil have minimal impact on the gameplay, but can have a good impact on getting people to stick. Tho i might be wrong.

If people arnt ready for this kind of mmo, they arnt ready. But there are probably a whole lot of mmo players that are ready, but dont know it yet.

 

[Grotebozebeer]

So your suggestion would amplify the problem.

Im not sure how many ARPK guilds there are compared to RPK. So its hard for me to judge on this. If it were about 50/50 i could see it work out.

I agree with your list of flaws.

Tho looking at myself, if there where indeed more pve and little noob bashing and skyrim-like combat, i would prolly play this for a long long time.

The features SV came up with are so fucking awesome, the crafting, the tupilak and more unique features like this is what wil blow a lot of minds.

I have faith in SV, in that they learned from their mistakes and have 15 years of expirience, and a fresh start. And more publicity trough youtubers, wich is way way more important now then it was back in the day. Guess we can only wait and see.

 

[Teknique]

MO2 is already sunshine, rainbow and bunnies. Where it should be a dark post-apoc.

Please don't make it more gross.


Newcomers don't leave when they're killed. They leave because they're killed by the zerg most of the time. (if at all)
Guilds in general are zerg source, and the main issue. So your suggestion would amplify the problem.



Imagine small groups all over the map instead of empty dead map and one single mass zerg in a single town?
That's what we're loosing from the guild system. Guilds are in fact killing the game. Plain and simple.

Then again, there's:
- Lack of PvE content for the solo / small group;
- Lack of proper PvP balance (which is already aimed towards mass PvP than single / small groups);
- Lack of common sense of balance changes in each patch.
-- ...
-- endless list of the current MO2 flaws here --
-- ...
- Better games to play solo / small group

There's lots of issues that will cause newcomers to leave. And those are more problematic areas than just getting killed.

In the end, each and every person in this game would have to choose:
- Join the guild (aka the zerg brain-dead gameplay);
- Struggle solo / small group;
- Leave

An obvious and most simplest choice for the solo players just to leave.

Moreover, I'm afraid that this issue will be the end of MO. There may be a situation in the future, where only one massive guild will remain.
Which will cause people to just leave the game since there's literally no-one to PvP / todo. Resulting in a completely dead game.
It may not come soon after the release, but its a possibility, and a major flaw of the current guild system.

MO always failed to provide content for the solo players.
Hopes were high for the change in MO2, but alas, I doubt it would get addressed in near future (if at all).

I think that’s just a function of reality. Mo emulates reality in terms of localization you can’t teleport places etc.

to be honest guilds (governments) are making me want to leave life. But playing real life solo is pretty hard core. I need t do what? Go camp out in the woods?

the point is it’s human nature and a necessity that people group up and those groups impose their rules on themselves and others.
Im not saying you’re wrong just that the forces that drive this kind of gameplay are undeniable

 

[Vergil]

the point is it’s human nature and a necessity that people group up and those groups impose their rules on themselves and others.
Im not saying you’re wrong just that the forces that drive this kind of gameplay are undeniable

Yeah, that's the problem.

If a game does not have content and forces to mass group just to make up for it out somehow - that's a sign of poor game design.
A large portion of audience will just drop it in few hours. Meaning no new blood -> desolation -> game over.

Mass zerg also negates the "skill" factor, which in the end boils down to how much people do you have fighting.
Numbers vs Numbers is no fun at all.


There should be always an option to go solo in small groups. But then again, there's no gradation for the PvE content at all.
Right now its pretty much mat grinding for PvP, just for the sake of PvP. Does it have any value? No, not really.

Sure its beta, but remembering back MO1 steam release / MO2 release could be just as bad.

Looking at roadmap, and seeing expanded PvE is promising. However, I'm not even sure SV could deliver anything of value for PvE in 2 weeks period.
So the hopes and expectations are low (at least for me). Plus the travel time to reach anything of value is about insane.

Proper solution would actually be to populate map quadrant by quadrant, adding proper content (mobs, ruins to explore, gear to loot etc).
Instead we got huge empty and dead world.

Nice.

Tbh, I'm sick and tired of MO1 copypasta. I've abandoned first one because of lack of the content.
And it seems like the same story again.

 

[Grotebozebeer]

Yeah, that's the problem.

If a game does not have content and forces to mass group just to make up for it out somehow - that's a sign of poor game design.
A large portion of audience will just drop it in few hours. Meaning no new blood -> desolation -> game over.

Mass zerg also negates the "skill" factor, which in the end boils down to how much people do you have fighting.
Numbers vs Numbers is no fun at all.


There should be always an option to go solo in small groups. But then again, there's no gradation for the PvE content at all.
Right now its pretty much mat grinding for PvP, just for the sake of PvP. Does it have any value? No, not really.

Sure its beta, but remembering back MO1 steam release / MO2 release could be just as bad.

Looking at roadmap, and seeing expanded PvE is promising. However, I'm not even sure SV could deliver anything of value for PvE in 2 weeks period.
So the hopes and expectations are low (at least for me). Plus the travel time to reach anything of value is about insane.

Proper solution would actually be to populate map quadrant by quadrant, adding proper content (mobs, ruins to explore, gear to loot etc).
Instead we got huge empty and dead world.

Nice.

Tbh, I'm sick and tired of MO1 copypasta. I've abandoned first one because of lack of the content.
And it seems like the same story again.

To be honest, i think you should cut SV some slack. Its good to be sceptical but you can take it to far.

Things that changed sinds 2010:

- In Mo 1, SV had a huge chalange with their network and had to make it from scratch. Now that no longer an issue>more time to develop content.
- MO 1 was the first attempt to a game, now they have 15 years of expirience.
- The U3 engine made it difficult to make new content, with the U4 engine they can focus on actualy making the content instead of trying to figure out how its possible to even make it work.
- 2010 everyone and their mother was playing themepark and loving it. Now we have new genre's (battleroyal/survival sandbox)
Poeple from games like these wil have a much easier time to addept to a full loot pvp mmo. On top of that, the urge for a fresh mmo, has never been bigger.
-Youtubers with big fan bases are taking intrest in MO2 with very positive reactions from the fans.
-SV has a small but deticated playerbase that has caried MO1 as far as it has gotten. If nothing els, there wil be more people that wil become part of that deticated base. Players from Darfall are now also among the ranks of MO players since DF is technicly dead now.

And eventho a lot of people wil dislike 1 char slot, it wil be good for $, net saying thats the plan behind the disign.


So after reading this list, is your view stil as persimistic? I mean, you cant say they are patching like a dry turd in a funnel. The opposite realy.

I get it, i realy do. All these shit promises from all these devs have gotten me sceptical aswell.
The amout of vapoware that this nich genre has endured also doesnt help a lot. But with SV you can be pritty certain they are giving it their best.
A dying breed that is in it for the game, and not the money.

 

[Wesley Snipes]

The way out stop new comers from leaving is simple. Reduce the tedious mechanics (like reserves), and inconveniencing stuff (like the lack of a world map; who thought this was a good idea?).

Newcomers don't want to run around blindly for hours, they also don't want to run for 45 minutes to meet up with their group because they get out of work at 6 but everyone else gets out of work at 5. UO had runes and teleports (which made the lack of a map in that game more bearable because you could just bind to a location).

Introduce more immediate and obtainable goals. Newcomers will easily get "lost" in the game, and with no focus these players will get either bored or disillusioned and quit shortly after. What is a "new comer" supposed to do once they leave haven? Hell, what are they supposed to do IN haven?

 

[Grotebozebeer]

The way out stop new comers from leaving is simple. Reduce the tedious mechanics (like reserves), and inconveniencing stuff (like the lack of a world map; who thought this was a good idea?).

Newcomers don't want to run around blindly for hours, they also don't want to run for 45 minutes to meet up with their group because they get out of work at 6 but everyone else gets out of work at 5. UO had runes and teleports (which made the lack of a map in that game more bearable because you could just bind to a location).

Introduce more immediate and obtainable goals. Newcomers will easily get "lost" in the game, and with no focus these players will get either bored or disillusioned and quit shortly after. What is a "new comer" supposed to do once they leave haven? Hell, what are they supposed to do IN haven?

Yeah, i can see those features not being everyones cup of tea. I understand why there is no teleport tho. Would make it to easy to siege all over the map, so i think no teleport is a good thing, aslong as the game provides anough content to do localy.

Lack of a worldmap, not sure about this one, i like the idea, not sure if i like the execution, but we wil see.
About the reserves, i think this is one of those features that wil end up being scrapped. tho a cool idea that you can become overweight/underweight and its something i have never seen in an mmo. Its something that wil just get anoying after a while, opposite to the map thing i think.
The map, or lack of it, wil take some getting used to, but the longer you deal with it, the easier it gets.

About goals, it never hurts to have a goal. I love games where you can just set your own, thats one of the biggest strenghts of this game in my oppinion.
But if they make MO2 have more goals in the sense of more content(better pve) im all in for that.

 

[Olympeus]

I think it will be a great idea to make it clear to any new player joining this game, that they can seek out ARPK Guilds

I think this is a great suggestion. At first, I thought to myself, "but isn't it obvious that Guilds are at the center of any MMORPG, especially an open-world, sandbox, pvp, full-loot, game? And anyone with a pulse and a brain cell will read the FAQ for Mortal Online 2 and they'll immediate understand that this game is deeply social and all about collaboration, community, and social interactions."

But the more I thought about the current state of the MMORPG genre, gamers, and even read some of the tragic replies to your post I realized I was wrong.

I think it would be very helpful for Star Vault and the Mortal Online 2 Community to find ways to make it abundantly clear for newcomers that Mortal Online 2 is reviving a now extinct breed of MMORPG, which means, among other things, that the game is intensely social and playing with friends is the way to go.

I would expand on your suggestion and say newcomers should be encouraged to join ANY guild that suits their play style. This can be a red, white, blue, black, or brown guild. This can be a mage guild, a traders guild, or a hard-mode solo players guild. Sure you can join a guild just for "protection" and definitely to learn the ropes, but there are many more reasons to join guild than this. Your guild will be where you spend most of your time, make most of your friends, and in a sandbox game, also generate a lot of content and allow you to generate your own content.

I completely agree with you that MMO gamers are ready for Mortal Online 2, but many may not even realize it. Consider your audience:

1. MMO gamer post 2010: There is a high probability these folks have never played an MMORPG that wasn't ruined by "looking-for-group" finders, fast travel, quest hubs, solo-player, free-to-play, cash shop, cosmetic store fronts, cross-population servers, paid-for-<fill in the blank>, and all other manner of garbage.
2. MMO gamer pre-2010: There is a high probability these folks played an MMORPG where reputation mattered and community mattered. Grouping and player/class interdependence mattered. But even these people, if they have continued to play MMOs since 2010 could have been brainwashed by the modern stupidity.

A subscription-based game needs long-term player retention, and that starts with the community and the relationships that a player forms within the game. Star Vault are spot on in putting community at the forefront of their game design.

Modern MMOs couldn't care less about player retention. They are all free to play and they only need to monetize through their cash shop. Even the sub-based modern MMOs still make the VAST majority of their money through a cash shop.

Star Vault have their work cut out for them in terms of marketing and explaining what this game is to a massive audience of "modern" MMO gamers and "veteran" MMO gamers that quite frankly have no idea what to expect or have forgotten what to expect from a game like this.

I think suggestions like yours a great. I think the Mortal Online 2 community should follow-suit and do their best to spread the word.

 

[MyrmexThraxvágr]

The competition of guilds keeps this game and its playerbase alive. The complete opposite of what wow is on that spectrum.
That is how difficult it is to pull this game off, yet If the game shall have things that can both benefit the individual player and the group player, it would be a win win for everybody.

Make it so one person can earn his way to the top by committing himself to the community in its support and content in his local town, be it for ressources, trade, knowledge or reputation. If you can pve this game then the pvp game can survive longer, food comes in, the hungry will be fed.

A player has earned his way to the top as a mayor of a local town by genius and unique trade off or slaying of a monster boss nearby that was endangering the town. If it is already governed the player could casus belli him and earn his place due of the local citizen holding him in high esteem. That play would need protection, the guilds come in and fight to last his life. If successfull his reign will expand on territory and so on and maybe become a king?

That is now an example and how a feudal medieval kind of political system has worked and could be incorporated in this game by doing deeds to a local town earning your way up you to positions. That is for the pve kind of game. Once more dungeons come in and all kinds of different mini bosses and creatures, the whole game will be more interesting for sure, especially once players can build their own settlement.

 

[Grotebozebeer]

I would expand on your suggestion and say newcomers should be encouraged to join ANY guild that suits their play style. This can be a red, white, blue, black, or brown guild. This can be a mage guild, a traders guild, or a hard-mode solo players guild.

I agree that everyone should find their own place in MO 2. Ofcourse not all new players wil want a relatively safe expirence. Tho the ones with the general mmo mindset, not knowing what to expect.

The reason i thought of this was my personal expirience in full loot pvp mmos, and the fact that i hate it when someone much much stronger then me wil just kos me even tho he /she knows im no match/new and gains little to nothing by killing me.

While browsing the forum i read in on ARPK and RPK guilds and loved the way ARPK guilds protect the new.
For me personaly, that is very reassuring and alows me to kind of make it a Roleplay thing, even tho i dont do roleplay in the traditional sense.

It just fits in the whole realism fibe MO got going on. And i think ur right, even tho this is a mmo centered around guilds, outsiders couldnt begin to imagine what MO2 got in store for them. If only they can get to the point where the real fun begins.



As for the rest of your post, couldnt have discribed it better myself.

 

[Grotebozebeer]

The competition of guilds keeps this game and its playerbase alive. The complete opposite of what wow is on that spectrum.
That is how difficult it is to pull this game off, yet If the game shall have things that can both benefit the individual player and the group player, it would be a win win for everybody.

Make it so one person can earn his way to the top by committing himself to the community in its support and content in his local town, be it for ressources, trade, knowledge or reputation. If you can pve this game then the pvp game can survive longer, food comes in, the hungry will be fed.

A player has earned his way to the top as a mayor of a local town by genius and unique trade off or slaying of a monster boss nearby that was endangering the town. If it is already governed the player could casus belli him and earn his place due of the local citizen holding him in high esteem. That play would need protection, the guilds come in and fight to last his life. If successfull his reign will expand on territory and so on and maybe become a king?

That is now an example and how a feudal medieval kind of political system has worked and could be incorporated in this game by doing deeds to a local town earning your way up you to positions. That is for the pve kind of game. Once more dungeons come in and all kinds of different mini bosses and creatures, the whole game will be more interesting for sure, especially once players can build their own settlement.

Yeah, would be realy cool to have a political system like this ingame. That is indeed some good pve content.

Guess the pve wil always cather to the pvp in games like this and in that regard wil be harder to make intresting for pve only players.
But if they can pull off the awesome and unique features in this game, i can see a realy good future for MO.